Widescreen Gaming Forum

Kind of jumping to the end, so pardon me if I am duplicating another suggjestion already made.

First the GTX 295, why two? It just came out so its incredibly expensive also it would be considered "quad sli" wich has little support and probably poor drivers.

This is not the kind of thing that if you do not get it now you cant have it later. So what I highly suggest is if you want those cards fine, but only get one for now and see how well it takes care of you. As you may be surprised like I am with just a single 4850 and find you did not need the 2nd one.

If you do find you want it later on, then you can get it later on at a reduced price.

HDD's - For gaming do not expect a boost in performance in Raid 0, or most other things at that. Its good for video editing, and.. video editing and thats about it :P. Single very large continuous files are what Raid 0 is for. That and kids with too much money and too little time to do there research.

If you want a fast drive with no hassles, the VelociRaptor is a great drive and still much cheaper than a SSD or something that can compare to it. I wont give you the long speech on why that drive is good but trust me my boss had one and I built his computer, its a nice drive.

Redundancy of data, You can do it with any kind of mirrored raid setup, lose maybe just a small amount of speed that you wont notice but lose HDD space, if your data is important do it. If its not then just be prepared for the day you may lose it. A file server that does auto backups of your system(s) is also an option and the route I plan to take when I can afford to build one.

I really like the 640GB WD drives, with 320GB per platter they run cool & quiet. The have a very low fail rate unlike the 1TB drives for some reason that drop like flys. The high data density makes them faster tham other drives in that range, and the lesser phisical mass of only 2 platters is what probably directly translates into the cooler running temp, lower power draw, and longer life.

However I am finding I fill them up fast and may go for 1TB drives myself next build, atleast a couple of them for movie storage and leave the 640gb for my system drive.

When I take a close look to the rest of the system it would be a shame if the Harddrive would become some kind of a bottleneck...

I think it would be the best to spend that little bit of extra money for the 10.000 Rpm WD VelociRaptor

And have a 1 TB Samsung SpinPoint F1 for storage

It´s certainly no bang for the buck but than again I can´t really say that for the rest of the system, can I :lol:

I dunno, Jurgen, you've gone for an i7 920, rather than a 965. :D ;)

(Sorry for the thread-jack...) I dunno why the 1TB drives 'drop like flies'... but others have mentioned this in different threads - I've been running three 1TB Samsung drives since... June or so?... and they're still going like champs. I crunch video on them, so they get a workout. But I do make sure they're cool. Even when two of them are going full-bore with reading/writing video encodes, they never go over 30*C. Is it Seagate or WD or everyone that has had problems?

Kind of jumping to the end, so pardon me if I am duplicating another suggjestion already made.

No problem at all! Thanks for your input!

First the GTX 295, why two? It just came out so its incredibly expensive also it would be considered "quad sli" wich has little support and probably poor drivers.

This is not the kind of thing that if you do not get it now you cant have it later. So what I highly suggest is if you want those cards fine, but only get one for now and see how well it takes care of you. As you may be surprised like I am with just a single 4850 and find you did not need the 2nd one.

If you do find you want it later on, then you can get it later on at a reduced price.

I want to play games with a 5040x1050 resolution (3x 1680x1050) and would like to have all settings maxed out!

If one GTX295 can dot that for now, then I will be more than happy to take your advice!

HDD's - For gaming do not expect a boost in performance in Raid 0, or most other things at that. Its good for video editing, and.. video editing and thats about it :P. Single very large continuous files are what Raid 0 is for. That and kids with too much money and too little time to do there research.

If you want a fast drive with no hassles, the VelociRaptor is a great drive and still much cheaper than a SSD or something that can compare to it. I wont give you the long speech on why that drive is good but trust me my boss had one and I built his computer, its a nice drive.

Redundancy of data, You can do it with any kind of mirrored raid setup, lose maybe just a small amount of speed that you wont notice but lose HDD space, if your data is important do it. If its not then just be prepared for the day you may lose it. A file server that does auto backups of your system(s) is also an option and the route I plan to take when I can afford to build one.

I really like the 640GB WD drives, with 320GB per platter they run cool & quiet. The have a very low fail rate unlike the 1TB drives for some reason that drop like flys. The high data density makes them faster tham other drives in that range, and the lesser phisical mass of only 2 platters is what probably directly translates into the cooler running temp, lower power draw, and longer life.

However I am finding I fill them up fast and may go for 1TB drives myself next build, atleast a couple of them for movie storage and leave the 640gb for my system drive.

You think that one WD Caviar Black 640 GB, 7200 Rpm, 32 MB would be fast enough for the job

That is an excellent idea! Thanks!

For storage I will be using the 1TB Samsung Spinpoint F1

I dunno, Jurgen, you've gone for an i7 920, rather than a 965. :D ;)

Yes I did, it makes it just a little bit affordable... Makes more sence...

Keeps things simple back at home...

Darling, I just spent $$$$$$$$ on a Computer :twisted:

(Sorry for the thread-jack...) I dunno why the 1TB drives 'drop like flies'... but others have mentioned this in different threads - I've been running three 1TB Samsung drives since... June or so?... and they're still going like champs. I crunch video on them, so they get a workout. But I do make sure they're cool. Even when two of them are going full-bore with reading/writing video encodes, they never go over 30*C. Is it Seagate or WD or everyone that has had problems?

Looks like we have a winner:

System drive: WD Caviar Black 640 GB

Storage: Samsung Spinpoint F1 1TB

I want to play games with a 5040x1050 resolution (3x 1680x1050) and would like to have all settings maxed out!

If one GTX295 can dot that for now, then I will be more than happy to take your advice!

While I don't use TripleHead, the GTX295 seems to start struggling at 2560x1600... (4M pixels) an indicator of not enough memory (and memory bandwidth), IMO... so I'd imagine that an even higher res in the form of 5040x1050 (5.3M pixels) would make it even more memory limited.

So I'd wonder whether dual GTX285's (with 1GB of VRAM) with the option to go to triple-SLI if the framerate is poor wouldn't be a better idea than quad-SLI...

Equally, I'd also wonder whether it might not be an idea to get a single GTX285 or something, then see what happens when the refreshes happen. Of course, there is always something better around the corner in the tech world, so...

You know I would not be surprised if a single GTX 295 can handle that res and max out MOST games, just dont be expecting to max out Crysis or something.

This is more of a bad game coding fault than lack of hardware. There are some games out there that simply are not well optimized that take way more power than what should be necessary to deliver the results you may want.

Also when I max out a game that usually entails all game visual options, AF, but only 2x AA. I find maxed out AA is a huge performance killer for little or no visual gain.

Most benchmark sites would probably max out AA for there tests, so you can consider your own frame rate to be higher if your willing to tune that down and still consider it maxed out.

I just think its a better idea to get one now, and see how it is. You can always get the 2nd one if you want it. However get both upfront and you may wish you did not and then would be in a bad position.

The 640GB drives are fast! but not 10k RPM fast (though pretty close to the original raptors, but not so close to the VelociRaptor) Do not get a Raptor though its a waist of money, they are not very fast anymore, but yet still cost a lot and come in very low capacities. Get a VelociRaptor if your really deadset on max performance. Or go the extra mile and get 15k SCSI drives and a controller card.

In my opinion not worth it for a user system, I can see a VR in a user system though as they prime drive if its in your budget.

I would like to know what works best in the end

2 x GTX 295
3 x GTX 285

Is it also possible to put in 2 GTX 295 and one GTX 285....?

The 640GB drives are fast! but not 10k RPM fast (though pretty close to the original raptors, but not so close to the VelociRaptor)

I can agree that the 640GB WD's are fast. I've been evaluating one for a couple of weeks as a drive for a build for my uncle. I'm gonna keep it. :D (And get him another, obviously...)

I would like to know what works best in the end

2 x GTX 295
3 x GTX 285

Depends on how they scale. In the past, going past two GPUs hasn't really been worth it apart from bragging rights as they don't scale very well (2 cards gets you about 1.5-1.8x performance of one, three cards gets about 2-2.4x performance of one, four gets maybe 2.5x performance of one...)

This review has some quad-SLI results you might be interested in. I don't think it's got any tri-SLI results, though.

Is it also possible to put in 2 GTX 295 and one GTX 285....?

Uh... maybe? But best it'll do is quad-SLI on the two GTX295's, then run PhsyX on the GTX285. So that's a bit of a waste, in those terms.

I just think its a better idea to get one now, and see how it is. You can always get the 2nd one if you want it. However get both upfront and you may wish you did not and then would be in a bad position.

I think that´s the best way to go

Buy one GTX 295 and see what it does

The 640GB drives are fast! but not 10k RPM fast (though pretty close to the original raptors, but not so close to the VelociRaptor) Do not get a Raptor though its a waist of money, they are not very fast anymore, but yet still cost a lot and come in very low capacities. Get a VelociRaptor if your really deadset on max performance. Or go the extra mile and get 15k SCSI drives and a controller card.

In my opinion not worth it for a user system, I can see a VR in a user system though as they prime drive if its in your budget.

I´ll stay with the 640GB WD Caviar Black as primary drive and the 1 TB Samsung Spinpoint for storage

Thanks!

Thing with SLI and Crossfire is sometimes they do not even work at all, as you add a 3rd and 4th card you just added to the list of issues you may have.

Bad performance (often in the past I read on how tri/quad sli does worse than a single card) being a big one.

A single high end card is always better than 2 of the lower cards.

This new thing that caught on to put two gpu dies on one PCB is not really a new high end card, its still just 2 of the old cards.

So I say the next wave of single gpu cards is better for the normal user if they were at the limit of performance they need. An exotic triple screen setup is an exception though almost requiring you to splurge on the really high end stuff like these dual gpu cards and SLI/CF.

Im personally ok with scaling games up too, if I found a single 295 was not enough at full 1050v I would maybe try the next res down to see how it does. Before I upgraded my PC to what it is now I had to play with a 800v res on my 37" screen :P It looked kind of soft but it was not bad and thats a very extreme case.

This is also why I am currently weighing a big monitor like mine @ 37" vs a triple wide setup. Its very immersive and I get none of the hardware headaches. I am hoping to find somebody on the forum that is a convert to get there opinion.

Dont forget these other cons of a multi card setup.

More Cards =

More Power Draw and that = More Hardware Cost/Demand for a better PSU

More Heat

More Things to Break

More Noise

To some that may not matter, for me in a small bedroom it gets noticeably hotter in here when I game :P

Eh, as soon as I've submitted my doctoral thesis, I'm buying myself a TH2Go and three new widescreens as a sort of 'I've finally done it' present. ;)

Paddy is the guy to go to for help with TripleHead. He's awesome. :D

...

Yeah, scaling with Tri- and Quad-SLI in the past has been really appalling. They don't seem to be quite so bad this time around... but there will always be a game that doesn't like multi-GPU setups.

You think that one WD Caviar Black 640 GB, 7200 Rpm, 32 MB would be fast enough for the job

Just acquired one and it works like a champ. My fastest drive, cool and nearly silent. I see you have selected this as your OS drive, which is a good choice. I was going to advise you to stay away from installing your OS on a RAID (especially RAID-0), unless you don't mind significantly complicating future troubleshooting issues. On my rig the C: drive is for Windows and drivers, everything else goes on different drives/partitions (pagefile, program files, media, games, etc.).

FYI to all, the Seagate 7200.11 1TB drives are the ones that are dying. Given that Seagate is also dropping their warranty period from 5 to 3 years, I'm going back to WD for future HD purchases. Also, WD owns 12 of the top 15 spots for internal drives on Newegg.

FYI to all, the Seagate 7200.11 1TB drives are the ones that are dying. Given that Seagate is also dropping their warranty period from 5 to 3 years, I'm going back to WD for future HD purchases.

That's dirty pool. :(

Eh, as soon as I've submitted my doctoral thesis, I'm buying myself a TH2Go and three new widescreens as a sort of 'I've finally done it' present. ;)

Paddy is the guy to go to for help with TripleHead. He's awesome. :D

...

Yeah, scaling with Tri- and Quad-SLI in the past has been really appalling. They don't seem to be quite so bad this time around... but there will always be a game that doesn't like multi-GPU setups.

You have a 40" right now right? You will be in a perfect position to give your opinion in the thread I just made in the surround section about converting form a single large display into small triple wide.

I wont be moving over for a long time. Money short and I do not even have room in my room/desk for 3 monitors. I am also very happy with the single 37" and find that I game less than anything else on my computer so being that gaming is the main draw for TH2GO for me, I seek to gain very little from it right now.

When the kids are grown up and I have more money/free time thats when its time to become a gaming addicted old man and enjoy the finer things in life. Heck I may even be tempted to go back to WoW and find a lonely middle aged men guild where we raid all day l long while BSing over Vent/Teamspeak lol...

You have a 40" right now right? You will be in a perfect position to give your opinion in the thread I just made in the surround section about converting form a single large display into small triple wide.

Yeah, I've got a 40" Sammy. When I do it, I'll let you know what I think. But it's not gonna be for at least six months. ;) If I submit in July/August, I'll be happy.

This is what I am going to do:

I will order the following parts:

Case: Antec Gamersgear Twelve Hundred
Power supply: OCZ EliteXstream 1000 Watt

Processor: Intel Core I7 920 2.66 GHz
CPU cooler: Thermalright Ultra 120 EXtreme
Mainboard: GigaByte GA-EX58-UD5
Memory: OCZ Intel I7 Triple 6 GB, PC3-12800, 1600 MHz
Hard disk 1: WD Caviar Black 640 GB, 7200 Rpm, 32 MB
Hard disk 2: Samsung SpinPoint F1 1 TB, 7200 Rpm, 32 MB
Graphics card: BFG GeForce GTX 295 1792 MB
Sound card: Razer Barracuda AC-1
DVD writer: Samsung SH-S223F

Monitor: Samsung SyncMaster T220


Soon I will get my hands on a Matrox TripleHead2GO Digital Edition

Buy 2 more Samsung SyncMaster T220´s

See what a single GTX 295 does and when I am not happy with it, buy a second one

Thank you all for youre input and advice!

You´re the best!

Cool, now that I see your setup I can add more advise.

Soundcard: Why?

Vista breaks almost all hardware functions of a soundcard, and if your doing digital output the reciver is doing the work not the soundcard. On-Board is very good these days.

I do have a soundcard in my rig, but I purchased it smartly I got a refurbished X-Fi Xtreme Music for like $40 and I use analog output so the soundcard can effect the quality and I really like the 3DCMSS that the X-Fi has, also with Alchemy some games have EAX again.

If you do not have a specific reason for a sound card this is a area you can probably save money.


Ram: 6GB, guess that sounds smart for a new system I would get 6gb probably too if building with DDR2 because its dirt cheap. However DDR3 is not so cheap, also its early in its devolopment. The gains from 4gb to 6gb are none unless your doing very specific tasks that can break the 4gb barrier like RAM preview in video editing, or maybe ultra ultra high end gaming but I doubt even gaming can break that limit considering the card(s) your using.

This is another area where I can say get 4gb now, see how it is, and later upgrade to 6gb if you need it. By that time DDR3 will mature to be a better product and be cheaper.

CPU Cooler: I have that one its great! do not forget it comes with no fan though. The most common choice is a 1600RPM S-Flex fan because its known to have a high CFM (pressure rating too and this is important), its very quiet, and has a really long life.

The other parts like the Mobo & PSU I can not really say I know much about without looking them up. GigaByte makes good mobo's though, and OCZ makes good PSU's.

IMO the best PSU is and always will be PC Power & Cooling though :P

Ram: 6GB, guess that sounds smart for a new system I would get 6gb probably too if building with DDR2 because its dirt cheap. However DDR3 is not so cheap, also its early in its devolopment. The gains from 4gb to 6gb are none unless your doing very specific tasks that can break the 4gb barrier like RAM preview in video editing, or maybe ultra ultra high end gaming but I doubt even gaming can break that limit considering the card(s) your using.

This is another area where I can say get 4gb now, see how it is, and later upgrade to 6gb if you need it. By that time DDR3 will mature to be a better product and be cheaper.

Core i7 uses triple channel memory. And is DDR3 only. Going 4GB would nullify one of i7's most impressive abilities - it's sheer memory bandwidth.

So if going i7, there is no choice - it's gotta be DDR3, and unless you want to deliberately bottleneck the CPU, there's either 3, 6 or 12GB of RAM.

edit: If I go i7 in the near future (which I might) it'll be the Core i7 920, 6GB RAM, Gigabyte X58-UD5 that I get.

edit 2: OCZ own PC Power and Cooling now, anyway, so... ;)