Widescreen Gaming Forum

That's it - thanks Bongo. :D

I've read the whole thread, I promise!

Now, my problem is running Battle For Middle Earth II in widescreen. I'd like to use the whole height of the monitor, and fill in the side edges with black bars (like others before me) to maintain 4:3.

So, I'm just supposed to dodge into the Right-Click/Properties/Settings/Advanced... etc. Simple, eh?

Even though I have a DVI input and cable, I still can't find the checkbox to activate the option discussed above. Yes, I feel stupid, since it seems to work for everyone else with an nVidia card.

Native resolution on the monitor is 1920 x 1280 (or something similar).

Thanks,
Imp

I've read the whole thread, I promise!

:lol: :lol: :lol: LOL! :D

According to your specs, you have a Dell 2405FPW. Go into the monitors OSD (on screen display) and under image settings -> scaling, choose "Aspect: Increases Vertical image size to fit screen and adjusts Horizontal size to maintain proportional image". If you are unsure on how, go here.

I feel like Tantalus. There it is, exactly as described, the perfect solution sitting in the OSD of my monitor.

But it's greyed out! And per the link you so kindly provided, it shouldn't be.

Dell support has been useless so far, merely referring to the same link.

Why is fun so much work? :)

My fault... I forgot to tell you that you need to lower the desktop resolution into a non-native resolution (anything below 1920x1200 will do) like 1680x1050. Then it will not be greyed out anymore. :oops: You can only access the scaling option, when the resolution indicates that there is a need for scaling.

I got to the answer, and I feel a little silly :oops:

Here's how it might have played out.


-----------------------------------------
Person with common sense: "Are your drivers updated?"

Me: "Oh, 2004 wasn't that long ago, was it?"

PWCS: "Just humor me and try it."

Me: ***updates drivers***

Me: "Er, ah, well, now that works just like you said it would...."


Narrator:

So, boys and girls, don't be like Imp. Update your drivers before asking stupid questions!
----------------------------------------------------

Cheers, and thanks,

Imp

I just want to say that to those who started this tread and did the research... Thank you sooooooo.......ooooooooooo much! :D

I've got myself the Dell 2405FPW and I've got quite a few games that dont come in the native widescreen, however, I'm really not against playing it on a 4:3 resolution. Problem was that my monitor streached it out and it drove me nuts. Now that I can play with the black bars on the sides, the games feel like normal again. Playing with my 24 incher at 4:3 still is larger then the 19 inch monitor I migrated from.

Anyway, the simple fix provided by Tamiln was what did the trick for me. You guys are the best...

Welcome and congratulations with new screen! Always nice to help a fellow widescreen gamer! I also like the picture to be pixel perfect, though I prefer widescreen as well. Hate stretching, so it happens I play it in 4:3 as well. The 2405FPW should do the scaling nice for you though and stretching isn't so bad in some games.
Thank you, but it was really WIZ32 who came up with the trick you needed to access scaling options on the 2405FPW. :D

I second the thanks wholeheartedly.

What's amazing to me is that good people like Tamlin are 1) quicker and 2) more accurate than the Dell customer support people who are paid full time to answer these questions.

Cheers,
Imp

I shoulda posted this awhile ago, I had this ticket for awhile.

I believe I figured out the cause of this problem. I contacted ATI inquiring about this problem on laptops. This got me nowhere because he kept saying to bother the manufacturer. I then pretended I was planning to buy a screen for my desktop. They claimed that I should see the options as long as the drivers for the screen were installed. So I asked about screens which were not provided drivers and defaulted to windows drivers. I got the following reply:

"Then you would have a problem with the monitor. If it does not have drivers and relies on EDID information there will be issues.

It is a similar problem that the laptops have. There is no information provided by the screen to the drivers, the dirvers have to be custom written for the display."

So here is the answer. I do not exactly know what is stored in the EDID but it seems that some have more or better information than others, which would result in the missing scaling functions and weird panning. Is it possible to write our own custom screen/monitor drivers?

https://support.ati.com/ics/support/default.asp?deptID=894&task=knowledge&questionID=21578

So here is the answer. I do not exactly know what is stored in the EDID but it seems that some have more or better information than others, which would result in the missing scaling functions and weird panning. Is it possible to write our own custom screen/monitor drivers?

I think you are on the right way. I was experimenting last friday (Apr 21, 2006) and figured out my system can do nonstretched image at 1280x720, 720x480 and other nonstandard resolutions but not with 640x480, 800x600, 1024x768.
All "good" (1280x720...) modes were reported by monitor as 1440x900 (image located in the center and not scaled, according to ATI driver settings) and all "standard" modes reported by monitor "as is" (1024x768 was reported as "1024x768"@85Hz, was scaled without preserving aspect ratio, however settings was just the same).
When I changed settings to "Scale to panel size" (sorry, my setup screen is in russian language and I do not know correct english text for that checkbox) all resolutions was scaled standard (1024x768,800x600,640x480) and nonstandard (1280x720, 720x480 ...). In general, that "scaling" switch workes but not for most expected resolutions such as 1024x768.

I have Radeon 9600Pro, Catalyst 6.4 N2O (does not matter, I have original Catalyst 6.2 from ATI and it does not work also), Viewsonic VA1912w with 1440x900 native resolution and driver installed (LCD connected with DVI cable).

I tried PowerStrip to set so-called "resolution in resolution" but it did not work. I know, PowerStrip workes on nVidia and have tested it on another computer with nVidia and CRT monitor. But it does not work for my Radeon and wide LCD at all. I will try to install nVidia for short time and figure out, maybe it will work even without PowerStrip.

So, maybe custom display driver can help or ATI can make a workaround (special option for people who have problems) to work with 640x480, 800x600, 1024x768 just as it done for non-standard (like 1280x720, 720x480, ...), sending to LCD 1440x900 picture with 1024x768 (for example) inserted in it.

I do not know exactly how it can be done, but I think if there exists the solution for nonstandard modes, there exists a solution for 1024x768, 800x600, 640x480.

I do not know exactly how it can be done, but I think if there exists the solution for nonstandard modes, there exists a solution for 1024x768, 800x600, 640x480.

submit a ticket to ati about this and see if they can resolve it. Also, make sure your lcd has the latest drivers (if there are any). You are still missing the "expand while maintaining aspect ratio" option, which will expand is as far vertically as possible and scale horizontally just enough to maintain the aspect ratio.

I don't hold a lot of hope for ATI actually doing anything. It seems like from browsing around people have been asking for this feature since LCDs became popular and yet ATI has done nothing. It actually seems like their driver department doesn't really pay attention much to the actual users. I mean...does anyone actually like that bloated CCC? :P

I'd just plan to switch to an nvidia card...but I think this option is broken on their 7 series as well! Argh!

I'd just plan to switch to an nvidia card...but I think this option is broken on their 7 series as well! Argh!

About the nvidia driver with the 7 series.

These options allow you to determine how lower resolutions are displayed on your flat panel:
[list]
[*]Display adapter scaling[/*:m]
[*]Centered output[/*:m]
[*]Monitor scaling[/*:m]
[*]Fixed aspect scaling[/*:m][/list:u]

To sum it up(not in above order). You can have the gfx doing the up-scaling, having the monitor do the up-scaling or don´t use any scaling and display the res in its real ratio with black borders.

Thanks bongo. I noticed you have a 7 series part. Can you get all of those driver settings to work (particular the scale while maintaining aspect one)? What monitor are you using btw?

Thanks

edit: I see its listed, whoops! Does that monitor have options in its OSD to change scaling?

The above options goes for other series than 7, just wanted to refer to my system.

@ pingspike

Yes I can get them to work. If I choose Fixed aspect scaling and change the res to a lower res, doesn´t matter if it is 16:9 16:10 or 4:3 I get black bars to the right and left but the image is stretched from top to bottom and looks fuzzy like it is not a native res. What I think you mean is Centered output, if I choose that and change the res to whatever lower than 1920*1200(my screens native res) I get black bars on the sides left and right and top and bottom. It is like a picture in picture but centered in the screen. The picture is crisp sharp as it would be the native res.

Hope you understand :D

Yes my monitor has different scaling options built-in like fill to screen, one to one and fill to aspect ratio.

I've scanned these 3 pages and several others regarding fixed aspect ratio scaling with ATI cards (i.e., gaming 4:3 aspect maximized to vertical on widescreens with black bars on sides) . Many people have suggested using ATI Tray Tool, Powerstrip, or the CCC, but no one has commented on achieving SUCCESS.

My assessment is that this is an ATI driver issue and no one will have success until ATI (or someone very clever) creates a new driver incorporating this feature. Do others concur with this, or has someone had success using the above utilities?

I'm using a BenQ FP202W, an ATI X800 card, and the latest catalyst drivers.

thanks

I've scanned these 3 pages and several others regarding fixed aspect ratio scaling with ATI cards (i.e., gaming 4:3 aspect maximized to vertical on widescreens with black bars on sides) . Many people have suggested using ATI Tray Tool, Powerstrip, or the CCC, but no one has commented on achieving SUCCESS.

My assessment is that this is an ATI driver issue and no one will have success until ATI (or someone very clever) creates a new driver incorporating this feature. Do others concur with this, or has someone had success using the above utilities?

Unfortunately, I can confirm everything you say. I have been looking for this for over a year and a half now. :(. However, if someone could make a hack to override the EDID, I think we may be able to solve this. Unfortunately, I do not believe anyone is able to. Everyone in this thread would REALLY appreciate it if one of those smart hackers out there figured out a way to do this.

I'd just plan to switch to an nvidia card...

Unfortunately that is not an option for a lot of people. Most people, myself included, have this problem on their laptop, which means we can't switch to nvidia without buying a whole new machine.

For those of you having problems using the fixed aspect ratio in nVidia cards, I have a solution that at least works on my laptop's GeForce440 Go (though I don't know how).

First, I have the Omega Drivers version 1.6693 nVidia driver on a laptop instead of the standard nVidia driver. I don't really think that is necessary but I'm no expert.

Alright, first go to the nView display manager, which is accessible though Control Panel->Display->Settings->Advanced->Whatever your card name is.

Then, go to nView display settings (on mine it's also Device Settings->Device Adjustments) and select "Fixed Aspect Ratio" and confirm.



Normally, when starting an application under this setting, the screen will become garbled. If you let it run too long and hard quit the application your desktop will also become garbled, at which point you have to do a double ctrl-alt-del restart and hope that it doesn't carry over or becomes viewable enough to change the screen settings back or even go so far as to system restore or uninstall your display driver.

HOWEVER, I have found that I can actually use this setting as it was meant to be used.

After you change to fixed aspect ratio, before starting any program and testing it out, go to the Desktop Management tab and enable all the desktop management settings if they haven't been already. Then go to Hotkeys, which is under Desktop Management. Open the Display mode tab and select "Toggle LCD Scaling" and select Add. Then assign it to a key combination you don't use very often. Confirm.



Now if you have separate programs that allow widescreen stretching orrequire a centered output this hotkey is useful as is, but it has a much better use here.

Open up your program that you want to show in a fixed aspect ratio. If you've done the first part and you have my problem, the screen should be totally garbled with ridiculous scanlines. At any time you want, press the hotkey that toggles LCD scaling (that you specified) twice, so it is turned on and off.

If you have anything like my configuration, you will automatically be gifted with the black-side-bar display with the perfect fixed aspect ratio, no stretching involved. This will stick, probably, as long as the application runs or does not change its own resolution. If it becomes regarbled just do the double toggle again. And if you want to run centered, just toggle on and leave it.


My configuration may be different from yours, but I hope the screenshots will guide you to the analagous portions required for this function. I hope this information can be applied to the other cards as well if similar problems exist. I hope it works for you.



Edit: Oh yeah. If this solution has already been mentioned somewhere, I apologize. I am not exactly a driver expert and so the particular lingo used must have gone over my head. I just found this out by accident.

So no one has a solution for the "fixed aspect ratio scaling" on ati eh? I would really really really appreciate it if some of you smart hackers out there took a look at my april 22nd post about EDID's. Just scroll up a bit and you'll see it. If you could spoof the EDID or something I believe we might get somewhere. Thank you all so much for your time. Please please please PLEASE... this missing feature is making me desperate!! Especially for us laptop users that can't easily switch video cards!!

Stupid ATI GRRRRRRR :x :x :x