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 Post subject: PSU Sticky
PostPosted: 03 Jan 2007, 20:20 
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Lets hope they start to lower the power requirments for video cards isntead of raising them next gen... we are getting really damn close to the "safe" max power a wall outlet can put out for some of our PCs.

I agree that I want power requirements to drop; that's important, yes.

However... I wonder what the max safe load on a socket is in the States? Because I've got a 3Kw convection heater plugged in in the next room with absolutely no problems at all - that's gonna draw way more than a 1Kw (or less, whatever) PSU, surely?


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 Post subject: PSU Sticky
PostPosted: 06 Jan 2007, 16:30 
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Want power ??

Then....

Ultra Products 2000W ATX Power Supply :shock:

http://www.legitreviews.com/article/436/1/


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 Post subject: PSU Sticky
PostPosted: 07 Jan 2007, 18:58 
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To give you an idea of real power usage:

I got an APC UPS at compUSA for about $25 apparently someone got one for $10 US on sale once.
http://www.compusa.com/products/product_info.asp?product_code=312016&pfp=BROWSE9&pfp=cat3 is it. 325 VA, 185 Watts max

Admittedly it won't keep a monitor and all the extras going on a true high end gaming system but if your computer's internal power supply is truly effecient (active power factor correction and 80+ effeciency) you don't need much for short term power loss for the PC only.

In the past I ran this setup on it:
on a 325 VA, 185 Watts UPS

Seasonic 400W Tornado A3
MSI K7T-Turbo2 (6330)
Geforce 5700 Ultra slightly overclocked
Athlon XP 1700+ overclocked to about 1.75 GHz reports as a 2100+
Volcano 7 HS/FAN
5 case fans (80mm)
2 hard drives (PATA 7200 RPM 8MB cache)
768MB ram (3 x 256 all doublesided sticks) running at around 140 MHz

The monitor was NOT on the UPS.

The UPS lasted just under 2 minutes (about 113 seconds) with a few web browsers open and an online 2D game keeping CPU activity around 10 to 30%.

Since then I've changed a number of components so I'm now running on the same UPS:

Seasonic S12-430
DFI nF4-DAGF
Geforce 6600
Athlon 64 3000+ overclocked 13% with the LDT at 225 and HT mult at 4x
CNQ is ON so freq changes from 1.025GHz to 2.075GHz depending on load
Stock AMD HS/Fan 70mm no heat pipes (PWM control between 15 and 69% of max RPMs)
Still 5 case fans (80mm)
2 hard drives (1 SATA 7200 RPM 16MB cache, 1 PATA 7200 RPM 8MB cache)
1GB Ram 2 x 512MB (corsair value ram running at DDR375 at load, CNQ might run the ram higher or lower at idle, I'm not going to do the math for all the permutations of CNQ).

In this config my IDLE AC draw is about 70Watts. Even though my power supply can get well above 80% efficiency in the sweet spot it is getting around 75% efficiency at this point in the curve. End result is ~70 watts AC is about 53 watts DC. So my so called 430 watt power supply is pushing 12% load with this system at idle.

At full load this system has never drawn more than 130 watts as measured by a Kill-a-Watt meter. At that point the S12 430 should be about 81% efficient in the US. That gives us ~130 watts AC is about 105 watts DC. So my so called 430 watt power supply is pushing 25% load with this system at full load.

Full load tests included rthdribl.exe, Prime95, rivatuner overclocking the video card and monitoring temps, speedfan monitoring temps.

To give you another picture my Dads current system is:

Seasonic S12-380
Asus A8N-SLI Deluxe
Geforce 7800GT
Athlon 64 X2 4200+ overclocked less than 5% with similar concepts as above
Stock AMD HS/Fan 70mm no heat pipes
Still 3 case fans (1 120mm and 2 92mm)
1 hard drive (1 PATA 7200 RPM 8MB cache)
2GB Ram 2 x 1GB the ram is DDR500 but I haven't bothered to fully tune for performance on his system. Not sure what I'm running his at.

The Asus A8N series is more of a power hog so his idle and load numbers are higher than mine but his idle numbers are still below 100 watts AC and his load numbers are in the mid 1xx AC range. Even if he hits 175 watts AC his power supply will be around 82% efficient and the DC draw will be about 142 watts or 37% of his 380 watt rating.

He has dual core processor already and his board is SLI capable. Yet he isn't even stressing a quality 380watt power supply.

The moral of this story? If your video card(s) aren't costing you more than the rest of the parts in your PC combined you probably don't have to worry about the wattage of your power supply. Dual core or even quad core processors that are designed properly won't draw a ton or power.

A quality 380 to 550 watt power supply can run stably a system that a cheap 800 watt power supply won't.

Video cards run in 4 power classes

No power plug
4 pin power
6 pin power
6 pin power x2

If the lower wattage power supply has enough connectors and is rated well by a quality review site like SPCR then consider it...


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 Post subject: PSU Sticky
PostPosted: 08 Feb 2007, 10:08 
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Joined: 07 Feb 2007, 06:23
Posts: 26
This is great information. I've been clocking and gaming for a long long time, and one thing I've learned is this...

There are two ways to pay for a power unit...
1. You can pay for it now. (The Easy Way)
2. You can pay for it later. :shock: (The HARD way, becasue you get to buy not only a new PSU, but more often than not new hardware to go with it. PSU's love to take out Graphics Cards too BTW.)

Most people think that a system's most important component is the mobo. Not...it's the PSU.

I've ran many, built mnay highly OC'd systems for myself and others, and am running a OCZ 520 right now. It's a great unit with strong rails and they don't sag under load. I've had a P4 3.2 Prescott up to 4.2GHz and nothing will pull a PSU down quicker than a OC'd Prescott. It didn't phase that unit.

PC Power and Cooling are excellent units. There are also mnay other good brands, but only certain models in those brands are good. Whatever PSU you buy, do your homework. It's worth it. There is not a single componet more important in a system than the PSU.

I did see a reference in the beginning of this thead about ThermalTake Purepower...PureJUNK! Absolute Junk. I don't say things like that very much, and I'm not a brand loyalist, but the claims they make about their units are pure bunk. I had a PurePower 420 I tested and that thing was useless in a stock clocked system much less an OC'd one. It got hotter than hell, the rails fluctuated like mad and when you called on it at all it would get even hotter and sag to the point of BSOD's and reboots. Every one of the rails were low unloaded. Never put one of those units on a system you want to keep, especially if it's OC'd. My freind also had one light the room up red and green one night when we were making a suicide run after his Neo went tits up. We were literally hiding under the desk and trying to get to the cord to yank it out of the strip. Hot electrical fires and LN2 don't mix real well! :shock:

Another great reason to use only quality PSU's is your house. Do you like living where you do now? Would you like to continue living there? Some of those cheapies are literally fire hazzards. Deer, Codegen, and the like are literally a fire hazzard and if you saw the pictures I have you'd never plug one into the wall much less hook it to a rig. I kid you not. If you leave your system booted up like I do they could literally burn your house down while you were away. They can burn with a vengeance and will spit fire out for many feet when they let go. It is scary.

I've seen some high end systems on here and I know what things cost. These things not only have large amounts of money in them, but countless hours of work that in some cases cannot be replaced. Protect all of that with a good PSU. 150-200 dollars US gets a good one. It's not a drop in the bucket compared to how much is in these systems, or even a graphics card alone. :)


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 Post subject: PSU Sticky
PostPosted: 06 Mar 2007, 05:36 
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Yeah thats all true Olevia. One other big diffrence between a cheapo psu and a nice one for sombody that likes to leave there system on 24/7 like myself is the efficantcy.

The more expensive ones do better (usually), wich means they use less power, as a result less money to spend on your electric bill, and less heat in the room that pc is running in.

I feel bad for people building like 8800GTX SLI systems....

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 Post subject: PSU Sticky
PostPosted: 05 Sep 2007, 23:36 
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Joined: 01 Dec 2005, 06:06
Posts: 3
Just a little update since this thread hasn't seen much action.

If SilentPCReview doesn't impress you Jonny Guru is considered one of the top reviewers of PC Power Supplies.

I still highly recommend SPCR but Jonny is an excellent 2nd source. The thread below is his recommended list for those that will go SLI/Crossfire and want to stay under $150 for the Power Supply.

http://www.jonnyguru.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1460


If you aren't going for a monster overclock with 2 or more video cards you should stick with a lower wattage Power Supply out of this short list:

Corsair VX450W
Seasonic S12-II 380
Corsair HX520W
Seasonic Energy+ 550W

Note that the Seasonic 380 watt PSU will power 90% of the possible configurations currently on the market. Only extreme gamers really need the extra wattage.

Oh and if you see one super cheap and really need to save money the Antec Earthwatts 380 is the cheapest power supply I'd actually pay money for but it isn't as nice as the other four I listed.


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 Post subject: PSU cable a bit short
PostPosted: 07 Sep 2007, 15:28 
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Joined: 05 Sep 2007, 04:39
Posts: 4
Question for all you PSU gurus,

I was completing the wiring of my new rig last night and the cable on my PSU to the 12v MB power connector is a tad on the short side.
Antec Nine Hundred case, PSU mounts at the bottom
EVGA 680i MB, 12v power at the top behind the ps2 ports
Thermaltake Toughpower 850w cable management PSU

The cable reaches but it's the only cable that I can't tuck away nice & neat like the rest. I asked Thermaltake if they make a longer cable but all they did is tell me how I shouldn't have bought a case with the PSU mount at the bottom. (Thanks Thermaltake).

I know I could buy the connectors and make myself a longer cable or an extension but was wondering if anybody here knows of any places online or brick & mortar where either a longer cable or extension can be purchased?

Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: Update
PostPosted: 03 Feb 2008, 20:07 
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Joined: 01 Jan 2008, 18:26
Posts: 8
This post needs to be updated to include the Corsair HX520 & 620

Killer PSUs ;)

ALOHA


Yeh I've read nothing but good about them. I've just bought the 620 myself, upgrading from an Akasa 550W.

Haven't had a chance to install it yet though. Does anyone know if I will need an 8pin ATX 12V extension for it in my Antec P180?


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 Post subject: PSU Sticky
PostPosted: 03 Feb 2008, 20:27 
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Joined: 20 Feb 2007, 20:18
Posts: 60
hey guys, i've heard of adaptive PSU that turn of the PSU when idle or under a minim load like browsing the net, and when under heavy load such as playing graphic intensive games it fires up the PSU fan....i think Antec has some of those PSUs? and i'd like to get a quiet PSU(when the fan is on), what brand should i be looking into for this kind of adaptive PSU? 650/700w is sufficient enough for me.

i'm running Core 2 EXtreme (QX6850), 8800GTX, 4GB RAM, 2 DVD writers, 750GB HDD.


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 Post subject: PSU Sticky
PostPosted: 03 Feb 2008, 21:10 
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hey guys, i've heard of adaptive PSU that turn of the PSU when idle or under a minim load like browsing the net, and when under heavy load such as playing graphic intensive games it fires up the PSU fan....i think Antec has some of those PSUs? and i'd like to get a quiet PSU(when the fan is on), what brand should i be looking into for this kind of adaptive PSU? 650/700w is sufficient enough for me.

i'm running Core 2 EXtreme (QX6850), 8800GTX, 4GB RAM, 2 DVD writers, 750GB HDD.


No psu turns itself off, since it would turn off the machine at the same time. You are probably thinking of the fan?:)

If you want a silent PSU, best place to look for one that actually are silent are:
http://www.silentpcreview.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=6&sid=d94711b76c7ab7f1898b926525d52428
They value silence above all!

If you get a good PSU, you don't need so much W for your setup. Check out the Corsair PSU finder:

http://www.corsair.com/psufinder/default.aspx


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