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 Post subject: BenQ W1080ST question
PostPosted: 19 Jun 2013, 00:59 
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Currently happy with my triple Optoma GT720 but always looking to upgrade. Does anyone know if the new short-throw BenQ projectors will accept 1080p @ 120Hz over HDMI? Scouring the internet has got me nowhere.

Armchair electrical engineers replying about how HDMI doesn't have the bandwidth for that need not respond. Mostly what I'm asking is if anyone here buys one can they try it out please and let me know.

Thanks,
Mike


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PostPosted: 19 Jun 2013, 18:37 
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Donno of anyone on this forum that has a W1080ST yet.

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PostPosted: 20 Jun 2013, 01:42 
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HDMI 1.4a does not support 120hz in 1080pixel.

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PostPosted: 20 Jun 2013, 18:56 
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Haldi wrote:
HDMI 1.4a does not support 120hz in 1080pixel.


The resolution isn't officially supported but I assure you the link has the bandwidth to do it. HDMI 1.3 was released June 22, 2006 and increased the single-link bandwidth to 340 MHz (10.2 Gbit/s). If you go read the VESA Monitor Timing Standard you can see that even [email protected] (Reduced Blanking) is possible from a bandwidth perspective (pixel clock is 317MHz). This is exactly why people are able to overclock many late model HDTVs (see some success stories at www.blurbusters.com).

Disclaimer: (part of) my real world job is designing, verifying, validating and performing fault analysis for chips with integrated DisplayPort/DVI/HDMI receivers and transmitters ... though I'm mostly the DDR guy. Thanks for the revelation about HDMI 1.4a, your attempt to dissuade someone from actually trying what I suggested is noted.


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PostPosted: 20 Jun 2013, 20:37 
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rdqlus wrote:
Haldi wrote:
HDMI 1.4a does not support 120hz in 1080pixel.


The resolution isn't officially supported but I assure you the link has the bandwidth to do it. HDMI 1.3 was released June 22, 2006 and increased the single-link bandwidth to 340 MHz (10.2 Gbit/s). If you go read the VESA Monitor Timing Standard you can see that even [email protected] (Reduced Blanking) is possible from a bandwidth perspective (pixel clock is 317MHz). This is exactly why people are able to overclock many late model HDTVs (see some success stories at http://www.blurbusters.com).

Disclaimer: (part of) my real world job is designing, verifying, validating and performing fault analysis for chips with integrated DisplayPort/DVI/HDMI receivers and transmitters ... though I'm mostly the DDR guy. Thanks for the revelation about HDMI 1.4a, your attempt to dissuade someone from actually trying what I suggested is noted.


For starters Haldi never mentioned bandwidth, secondly "not supported" has many connotations. It could mean, the option is not available in the drivers or control panel, if you change something and "break" your system they won't help you, it could mean you change something and you "break it" there is no warranty. It could however mean someone just hasn't tried, hasn't seen a setting, hasn't tried changing any driver settings.

Your post has the feel of being arrogant, cocky and rude, you were the one asking for help. To be honest if I could help you after what you just posted I just blatantly wouldn't!

You also didn't suggest anything you asked someone to help test something!

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PostPosted: 20 Jun 2013, 21:16 
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I think the only way that someone is going to find this out is to buy one and do the experiment personally. Gotta realize how specialized your question is and it limits the plausible amount of people capable of even answering. I plan on having one soon, but "soon" is relative to how much extra spending money I have over the next few months.

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PostPosted: 20 Jun 2013, 21:39 
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BHawthorne wrote:
I think the only way that someone is going to find this out is to buy one and do the experiment personally. Gotta realize how specialized your question is and it limits the plausible amount of people capable of even answering. I plan on having one soon, but "soon" is relative to how much extra spending money I have over the next few months.


Yeah, my request was mostly directed at you Brad since you're the type to go out and buy one of these. I figured I'd just make a post and maybe someone else could/would contribute if they had a chance.

@ LuckyNoS7evin: Sorry for sounding like an asshole but I knew when I made this thread that someone would come along and tell me all about how it wouldn't work and that HDMI didn't support 1080p @ 120Hz. I did mention that those people need not contribute. Now, I suppose thanks are in order to you for making people think that they could actually damage their projector by attempting this. That possibility is vanishingly small (0) since the micro-mirror device is updated at 144Hz when running in 1080p 24Hz 3D (aka it already has an officially supported mode that's faster than what I want) and the HDMI analog voltage levels would be within spec since they're still being driven from a graphics card.


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PostPosted: 20 Jun 2013, 22:46 
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rdqlus wrote:
Haldi wrote:
HDMI 1.4a does not support 120hz in 1080pixel.


The resolution isn't officially supported but I assure you the link has the bandwidth to do it. HDMI 1.3 was released June 22, 2006 and increased the single-link bandwidth to 340 MHz (10.2 Gbit/s). If you go read the VESA Monitor Timing Standard you can see that even [email protected] (Reduced Blanking) is possible from a bandwidth perspective (pixel clock is 317MHz). This is exactly why people are able to overclock many late model HDTVs (see some success stories at http://www.blurbusters.com).

Disclaimer: (part of) my real world job is designing, verifying, validating and performing fault analysis for chips with integrated DisplayPort/DVI/HDMI receivers and transmitters ... though I'm mostly the DDR guy. Thanks for the revelation about HDMI 1.4a, your attempt to dissuade someone from actually trying what I suggested is noted.


Sorry, my fault, i missread your post, tought you asked an engineer and he said it doesn't work because HDMI doesn't have the bandwidht.
Also most people that ask for Advice in this Forum don't even dare to overclock their GPU because they would lose waranty, so i underestimated you. I'm sorry.



I saw the 120hz TV overclocking on Blurbusters, but didn't really care. So i didn't pay attention if they were using HDMI or VGA/DVI.
So by a simple EDID edit you can get your GPU to send out 120hz, but you don't know if the Monitor(in this case Projector) accepts the Signal or still makes 60hz refresh...
Why not send a E-mail to the Review Sites that tested this projector an aks if they could try that out?
I haven't seen or heard of lot W1080ST in the wild yet.

If it doesn't work.... are there Projector Firmware mods around?.... do they even exist? ^^

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PostPosted: 20 Jun 2013, 23:07 
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Haldi wrote:
Sorry, my fault, i missread your post, tought you asked an engineer and he said it doesn't work because HDMI doesn't have the bandwidht.
Also most people that ask for Advice in this Forum don't even dare to overclock their GPU because they would lose waranty, so i underestimated you. I'm sorry.

I saw the 120hz TV overclocking on Blurbusters, but didn't really care. So i didn't pay attention if they were using HDMI or VGA/DVI.
So by a simple EDID edit you can get your GPU to send out 120hz, but you don't know if the Monitor(in this case Projector) accepts the Signal or still makes 60hz refresh...
Why not send a E-mail to the Review Sites that tested this projector an aks if they could try that out?
I haven't seen or heard of lot W1080ST in the wild yet.

If it doesn't work.... are there Projector Firmware mods around?.... do they even exist? ^^


Firmware mods for the micro-mirror control chip would be near impossible without the entire source and toolchain to build it. If it doesn't work it's likely due to the HDMI input stage of the projector not being capable of it and firmware mods aren't likely to fix that.

Blurbusters are suggesting you try all the different inputs available (including each of the HDMI inputs on the display device).

I've got a post on avsforum asking about the W1080ST and someone with a W1070 has just responded. It's likely that those 2 projectors share HDMI chipsets and TI DLP devices so if it works on his projector it will likely work on a W1080ST. Here's hoping that guy gets a chance to try it out.


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PostPosted: 20 Jun 2013, 23:09 
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rdqlus wrote:
BHawthorne wrote:
I think the only way that someone is going to find this out is to buy one and do the experiment personally. Gotta realize how specialized your question is and it limits the plausible amount of people capable of even answering. I plan on having one soon, but "soon" is relative to how much extra spending money I have over the next few months.


Yeah, my request was mostly directed at you Brad since you're the type to go out and buy one of these. I figured I'd just make a post and maybe someone else could/would contribute if they had a chance.

@ LuckyNoS7evin: Sorry for sounding like an asshole but I knew when I made this thread that someone would come along and tell me all about how it wouldn't work and that HDMI didn't support 1080p @ 120Hz. I did mention that those people need not contribute. Now, I suppose thanks are in order to you for making people think that they could actually damage their projector by attempting this. That possibility is vanishingly small (0) since the micro-mirror device is updated at 144Hz when running in 1080p 24Hz 3D (aka it already has an officially supported mode that's faster than what I want) and the HDMI analog voltage levels would be within spec since they're still being driven from a graphics card.


Sorry can you read my post again, where did I say it was the projectors you could break?

What I was saying was that if the graphics card or drivers do not "support" it over HDMI as in don't let you, you force the issue and change that programatically. This is on you, so if something does give up the ghost then you most like won't get support or warranty from anyone.

Like Haldi said it could be "a simple EDID edit you can get your GPU to send out 120hz" but what I was saying is it could cost if it goes wrong! Yes I'm no electrical expert but I do know if you start messing with stuff that is outside the "norm" i.e. overclocking (GPU, CPU, Monitors, Projectors) you usually void any type of comeback!

It's good to point out risks as some poor sod may end up doing something stupid!

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